If you’re in a leadership role today, you surely didn’t get there by accident. You have vision. You’re confident. And you’re at the ready to offer support and lightning-quick responses. But if you don’t effectively communicate these qualities to your people, how will they know you embody them? Frankly, they won’t. Despite leaders giving themselves gold stars in communication, only 13% of U.S. employees say their leaders communicate well, according to Gallup research. And that’s a colossal problem: 93% of workers surveyed by the Brunswick Group report that “leadership that communicates directly and transparently” is what keeps them on the job, bested only by pay and the ability to move up. The most powerful tool you have as a leader—to inform, engage, and inspire—is your voice, says veteran leadership communications coach Joel Schwartzberg. Yet all too often, our words fall flat; we get caught in our head, fail to truly understand our audience, or simply flub the landing. But it’s our words and awareness of their impact that make the difference between simply managing teams and inspiring them to do their best work. 

Meet Joel

Joel Schwartzberg is a leadership communications coach whose clients include American Express, Blue Cross Blue Shield, State Farm Insurance, the Brennan Center for Justice, and Comedy Central. He is the senior director of strategic and executive communications for a major national nonprofit and previously held senior-level communication and editorial positions with Time Inc., PBS, and Nickelodeon. Schwartzberg’s articles on effective communication have appeared in Fast Company, Harvard Business Review, and Toastmaster magazine, and he’s a sought-after business and communications podcast guest and conference speaker. He is the author of Get to the Point! Sharpen Your Message and Make Your Words Matter, which Seth Godin calls “a manifesto for giving talks that make a difference,” and The Language of Leadership: How to Engage and Inspire Your Team (Berrett-Koehler Publishers; July 13, 2021), which Kevin Eikenberry says “will make your communication more purposeful, meaningful, and inspirational.”

Timestamped Overview

During this interview Joel and I discuss the following topics:

  • Why communicating clearly and effectively is so important
  • Where leaders make mistakes with their communication skills
  • How to change your approach based on your audience
  • How to appear more empathetic and authentic 
  • How to effectively communicate in the virtual environment
  • Advice on communicating in various situations

Guest Resources

If you are interested in learning more about Joel’s resources be sure to check out the following links:

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The following is an AI generated transcript which should be used for reference purposes only. It has not been verified or edited to reflect what was actually said in the podcast episode. 


Takes a couple seconds for it to kick in00:00:09

Speakerby a couple me in bed of a minute00:00:12


Speakerall right jaw, a walking toothpick performs leadership. I guess so good to have you here today.00:00:26

SpeakerThank you, scott. It’s my pleasure.00:00:28

SpeakerSo we are talking about your book. Is the language of leadership today and I’m sure, probably other other things that will pop out from the questions I have for you, but let’s, let’s dive in let’s go hard, so I actually oh by the way, thank you for copy first off early. Well, you did a great great read. I thoroughly enjoyed it and I00:00:48

Speakerido again I was I yeah. I was actually it’s actually very high rate of miles away on a work trip and it took me no time whatsoever because I’m lots of time in the evenings to myself. Well, I really like the subtitle how to engage and inspire your team. So, let’s, let’s dive down that route first and a half!00:01:08

SpeakerAh how and why is it so important,00:01:12

Speakeras my design shows up by eric? Why is engaging in inspiring so important and why communication so effective? For it00:01:24

Speakersure, well one thing your son would know as well as you know that the way we perceive our leaders and the way we understand our colleague’s is not because of telepathy00:01:39

Speakeris not because they perform mine,00:01:42

Speakerour leaders, don’t do performance, dance, they communicate and that’s how we experience them. You know you could throw a rock and a bookstore and you’ll get a bunch of books on how leaders need to be this or that authentic, a transparent, compassionate dedicated, but how do their employees and their staff00:02:02

Speakertheir colleagues appreciate them. How did they recognize that? It’s through communication and the book I run twenty seventeen called get to the point. Talk about how to make a point make an effective point with this book, the language of leadership. I wanted to take that world of leadership and by the way that means you’re, a ceo00:02:22

Speakeror you want me, see you you’re running a corporation, we’re running a meeting. Anyone who needs to exhibit sort of leadership qualities, how can they use language and their voice to engage and inspire? When I took a language, I’m talking not just about speeches and talking about pod casts and00:02:42

Speakervideos and texting and posting tweeting all the ways leaders are perceived through communication by their staff and the only other thing I want to say about it is: I chose those two words in particular engage and inspire, because there are other words we ascribe to great leaders, they’re funny they’re, knowledgeable00:03:03

Speakera charismatic they’re, attractive they’re interesting. But if there are two words I think most bring leaders to the impact they want. It’s that they want to engage their team and we want to inspire their team. Those are the one two punches. I think leadership communications.00:03:23

SpeakerNo, I couldn’t agree with you more and the engagement and inspiration is truly would drive the team forward and shared podcast robert, achieving peak performance right. I talk about the three domains of leadership. Night is leading yourself leading your team, which is more, were rat right now, and it is well leading or organization or institution and and young. The ink00:03:43

Speakerjudgement and inspiration goes from your team and bleeds into your or your organization. Yet we see so many examples out there of how we’d quotable leaders just crash and burn failed epically in their communication style in the language that they use in the action00:04:03

Speakers, younger conduct, etc. So you why I am: where are the the macon, their mistakes here and we’ll water some? The ad? I guess the major pitfalls that leaders listen they’re right here right now can go okay,00:04:18

Speakernot this is something I need to avoid. I need to read this, so I like to break it down into my books. Is we talked about their short other? Not big philosophies, they’re, really about nuts and bolts lot of do’s and don’ts lot of tricks lot of exercises, a lot of tactics, so here’s one that gets to one of the big prob00:04:38

Speakerhomestead leaders have when they use communications, and that is that they start with the wrong question.00:04:46

SpeakerThe wrong question is: what can I say: what do I need to say? What do I want to tell my team?00:04:55

SpeakerThis is wrong question, because what is that action? That’s putting words out there as if no one is there to receive those words. The ball game is how your team perceives your words, receives your words and what they do as a result of what you say so not about you saying it it’s about them receiving.00:05:15

SpeakerSo is the wrong question. Is what can I say or what should I say, the right question is: what is my audience, my team, my employees? What do they want and need to know that those are two separate things, because what they want to know is usually something they’re already aware of. We want to know00:05:35

Speakerhow we’re going to move forward. We want to know what this we org will mean for my job, but the second, what I need to know, maybe something they’re unaware of a vocal leader, needs to tap into and understand. So it’s communicated effectively once you understand what your team wants and needs to know, then you work00:05:55

Speakerbackwards, and then you figure out to my speech or my poster, my video. How do I reach that goal of attacking release addressing that need and that want to know you have a goal right versus just a blank canvas? What am I going to say?00:06:14

SpeakerDamn now, you’re always go start with you into your audience, so god is it maiden young wives? They need to know an. I like that aspect of the right question right, because often I talk to here at the at the podcast is that us, as leaders were all the questions honestly answer so00:06:33

Speakerand I feel like at it in a communication aspect of your purse, news orbit answers voyages go during easter. Flora, blabbing off in you’re like well, does what they want to know. Where is your actually thinking? Well, just telling them what they want to nova scotia, okay, actually sitting there and thinking about okay? What is it that you need to know want to know shouldn’t?00:06:53

SpeakerNo with this current current situation right and if you answer yes to this question, to different audiences need to hear different things. The answer to that question is yes,00:07:03

Speakerthen you know the approach is all about your audience, not about you, because if it’s about you, you would say the same thing to everybody, but knowing your audience, your team one could be just the five people in the executive leadership team. The other could be the rank and file before organization whose could be two different messages. So it’s just another reason to focus on your00:07:23

Speakeraudience and not yourself.00:07:27

SpeakerNow that actually brings me up to a questionnaire. My mind is you make? A very good point. Is that certain audiences require certain style and they require certain language, so, for example, speaking to the board would not be you know, you wouldn’t use the same type of tone, language, six letters if you’re speaking to your shop,00:07:47

Speakercore group of men, men and women who are working so observing. How can leaders go about gauging that, especially in the middle zone, where it gets cold, murky or grave? Where should they fall towards regarding their tone, their approaching him that cetera frank for communicate with your team you’re on me of a story, I work with a ceo eh00:08:07

Speakerand she had just become a ceo and she had delivered a proposal to the board of directors and they’ve thought. This is great creepy arsenio, and then she had to give a speech to a people who work in one of the facilities where to deal with a lot of stresses because they were rebuilding the facilities, news00:08:27

Speakerlot of work going on there and her job. There was really to tell them thank you for putting up with all this and inspiring them with. You got well if my powerpoint to the board bowled them over. Surely these people will also respond just as well to my power point that I gave to the board with all the data in the vision and a some excuse.00:08:47

SpeakerNot all that group wanted to hear the rank and file were in a building was thank you for your patience. Have we been in reconstruction? Ah, I think what we did here in your building is gonna help you be more productive and keep me informed about evidence. That’s all they wanted thanks and inspiration. Instead, they got this five point pop eye.00:09:07

SpeakerSo how do we understand what to do for that audience? How do we know an audience? And there are several answers to that question, one of which is, you can survey that on it’s head of time you know, leaders often work in teams. Internal communications hr would sometimes called people teams a run. Some surveys use some people who work there pick out some pie.00:09:27

SpeakerPeople were leadership or sub leadership in that group. So, what’s going on there a? What do they want to hear from leadership? What do they need to hear from leadership? So it’s not guessing as if it’ll come to me, what that audience teeth here. Do the work ask people what they most want to hear what they most want to know tap into00:09:48

Speakerto a what individual people are talking about, and you know I know some ceos who do things like breakfast or lunch with the steal, their actual programs. They can hear on an ongoing basis what’s going on because the truth is and scott you’re. Getting to this, you can’t match what that team wants and needs to know unless you00:10:09

Speakerwhat they want and need to know, because it’s in the leadership is not about guess work. The same way, you rely on data to make a strong point about what to do in the fourth quarter. You need information to make the right decision about how to match your communication to the wants and needs of that community.00:10:29

SpeakerThat’s awesome and yadda. I think I think this is great point. Four, throw a very tactical, a tip for the leaders, anthrax resealed, a new leaders because there’s a whole a new leaders. Listening to the show is this is why you get off your butts and you get out of out of your own, listen to and you walk round, and you talk to00:10:48

Speakeryour people in in. In turn, you listen to what they refer to say that they’ll, give you a feel like okay. This is the type of information that they’re seeking, because they had middle dog remains telling you what the racing out their problem points, their pain points and the guy asking you know. Western meal was the way forward for like six months or in the bible.00:11:08

SpeakerThey will endless when a leader goes on. A listening tour is something else very positive happens. The people you’re talking to see you as someone who not only listens but appreciates the points of view of your people. What could be more inspiring than that and knowing that your boss is paying close attention to what you’re doing so they can be00:11:28

Speakerrespond to it,00:11:30

Speakerand so it’s sort of up a a bonus when a leadership takes the time to ask questions to listen, they send the message that they care about what their team is doing and the point of view of that team.00:11:47

SpeakerAbsolute now and I believe, firmly that people young team members, believing that the leaders thinks that their opinion matters and yeah the view their chairs above them is, is true. The motor driver of thing for rick break. It builds trust. It builds authenticity00:12:07

Speakerso, and those are two important qualities- trust nothing to see, because if you want them to follow you toward a vision, they have to trust you and they have to believe you. It’s trust and authenticity in their way through language of leadership that you can build authenticity and show vision and show empathy. You know, and I keep harping on the00:12:26

Speakerthe ways to do this, because you can tell leader: hey you know what you should be more authentic. You know it used to be more empathic. What do you do with that? Are you do they have to seek out psychotherapy? Aware of how do I become more empathic, or at least how do I communicate to others that I am empathic and that’s the key? What are the tactics them00:12:47

Speakermindsets and even the words that say, I’m empathic listening to you, I’m going to try to get in your shoes to understand this problem. You’re lonely basically take ticket the question, my mouth hair, so how how do leaders bobo coming across as more empathetic or more authentic to the group00:13:07

Speakerwhen you’re trying to converse turn their message to them?00:13:10

SpeakerI would say there are three steps again. I like to build very clear recommendations and call them acknowledged air and action.00:13:19

SpeakerThe first step is acknowledge. You need only to solve people’s problems and scott. Sometimes, teams don’t need their leaders to solve their problem so much as acknowledge that there is a problem and putting a message out there to leaders it’s easier to acknowledge than to saw. I think everyone can agree with that. So00:13:39

Speakerwhat does acknowledge sound like I recognize? This is an anxious time for all of us. Ah, I see the pain we’re going through or I see the individual challenges you have working in this environment.00:13:54

SpeakerThat’s it out. A number two is care. I care about the stress level of the work. Life balance, your sense of safety and stability and number three is action. We don’t always associate action with empathy, but in terms of the language of leadership, think people are looking for is the00:14:13

Speakerfinal step. In again, this isn’t necessarily here’s the three step process we’re going to bring in a to solve your problem, but we’re gonna take a hard look at this by forming committees, we’re gonna bring in outside consultants. I would start with the first level of policies.00:14:34

SpeakerIt’s a to really understand the issue, so we can take the right step, not the wrong step to solve that problem, so acknowledge care and action leaders illustrate that, through their words in through their voice,00:14:49

Speakerpeople understand that that leader is empathic.00:14:55

SpeakerAh, I rely especially last part the action part because of nothing destroys authenticity than someone who says. Ah yes, I understand you. Yes, I feel for you. Yes, we need to do something about it00:15:08

Speakerin an afternoon bracket their pets. Right, it’s a it’s a promise, that’s not followed up on by the way. Scott.00:15:15

SpeakerYou know, I language of leadership is also by words, and I want to share two magic words when it comes to empathy- and it’s this rest assured00:15:26

Speakerthere’s something magical when leaders say rest assured, it conveys hope, which is another thing, talk about how to convey hope, but it says to people somewhat magical weeks. It’s only two words. This is going to get done. It’s thomas, a code for that. So I’m not saying you just say. Rest assured we’re gonna, get there,00:15:46

Speakerput emphasis and put actual ideas on the table, but I recommend, using those words cause the words. Rest assured are instantly reassuring.00:15:59

SpeakerRest assured, podcast listeners press enter the captcha,00:16:04

Speakerabsolutely love it now00:16:07

Speakeryou’ve hit than earlier about you know. The times were were living in and we talked about it. I just before we hit record and I think we would be remiss to not discuss some of the challenges that leaders have in this day and age of had in the past, all going on two years now00:16:26

Speakerof of veal, really working in a virtual environment almost solely right- and I hear it all the time from leaders boss not the same as being at work, but not the same as being face to face of the only communications that there can’t read the body, language and cameo can feel the pulse of the room,00:16:46

Speakerroom, etc. All these different, not gonna, call them meal and call a spade a spade excuses here are not young, getting the sense of how other people are doing, etc and communicating with a properly so from your standpoint, know what are the best practices in this virtual environment now for leaders out there to ensure that they remain engaged with their people,00:17:06

Speakerthe inspire other people or connected connect with them and pushing out their mission for well. I I don’t like to fall into the swell of isms are, but there isn’t isn’t here and it’s called zoo fatigue and what you get google it and when zooming fatigue basically says in there been some shallow stuff00:17:26

Speakerhe’s on it. Let’s say that, but they are saying that it’s stressful, that your body in your home, in your pajamas or whatever the kids, are everything says at home. Relax.00:17:41

SpeakerOh my! You will be watching television, but your mind is at work and you’re in a meeting at those two things cause are stressful, because they’re working against each other and at home know. I met my meeting so one of things. I try to encourage people to think is when you’re at work trying to physically be at work.00:18:01

SpeakerI wear something that you would wear to a meeting show background that supports you at the idea that you are making points related to your subject matter, or you know, whatever business you’re in a poor example, a lot of people bookshelves behind that matt says: hey you’re, reading00:18:21

Speakerwe’re smart or the orders through something neutral back there. I do a lot of work in animal welfare. Sometimes, so it’s not why I have this picture up here, but it’s white and pick it out at his picture of a dog on a bed, so just recognize that you need to do everything possible to clear yourself of distractions, especially if you have a second screen00:18:42

Speakerturn it off or put nothing on it. If you have a phone turn it over remove every kind of distraction that you have and people know that you know when you go to a regular meeting in a real room announcing, we know not to check our email the same time, what’s even harder on zoo, because there are so many more things distracting us00:19:02

Speakernow. Let’s talk about some real brass tacks: let’s talk about framing,00:19:06

Speakerso we’ve seen enough zoom meetings where someone is back here or there in their head is cut off or there all the way on the side, and they can see themselves. It’s no reason to do that. It means they don’t care. They think it doesn’t matter if it’s audio, even though everyone could see each other,00:19:23

Speakerbut just like when you’re giving a speech, you would want everything to come from your head and shoulders in zoom to you want to fill it up with your head and your shoulders as much as possible without cutting anything off a too far back in your creating distance between you and your audience. Your far to the side anyone’s looking here at the middle,00:19:43

Speakerinstead of at your face face forward at the last thing I wanna say: that’s really important- is eye. Contact in a zoo is completely different and eye contact in a meeting so and zoom. We want to look at people’s faces cassettes what we do in real life. I called the brady bunch grid,00:20:02

Speakerand that makes sense, but as I’m looking at you now, scott and I’m going to describe this- for the people were just listening. Ah, you are not seeing me looking at here, you’re seeing me looking s off center. That’s because that’s not where my cameras may cameras here and I’m pointing to it right now, so the the general rule is when you’re coming round to a very big point.00:20:22

SpeakerThis approach is going to save lives.00:20:26

SpeakerThis idea is gonna help us some more coke coal delivered that point right into the camera, because you know from just giving speeches eye contact is critical. Critical one zoom, icon tech means looking into the camera not into the brady bunch grid00:20:48

Speakeryeah nuff, the dirt by last points just crucial, and it it’s so actually sought to do, and I am a it- is difficult yeah, because it’s an old, blacktop, yeah yeah, exactly it was looking into this random old box. That’s they are okay. On the top of my monitor here,00:21:05

Speakerhello. I see you at the perfectly of my of my eye but you’re right, though, because that’s how it comes across terrain that listener and that’s what matters the most right, and so how can we help people look to the camera? One thing I always says if you have assumes greenery of notes, push that is high up on your monitor it00:21:24

Speakerit’s possible so that between your camera and your notes, your camera and your power, pointing your only moving your eyes. This is the rule of thumb. Have them close enough to we’re only moving your eyes to move from camera to powerpoint or count right to notes not moving your head or your neck is of watching a tennis game, because looking away your00:21:44

Speakerbreaking a connection with that audience and by the way, when you’re in a zoo meeting, guess what you don’t really need to look at yourself in guess what you don’t even really need to look at everyone out, sometimes it’ll throw you off when someone in your audience is looking to the side. You may think oh they’re bored with me, but actually the puppy in00:22:04

Speakertheir room is doing something distracting. That’s why they’re looking for says nothing to you to do is presented something I always say to the ceos. If you have notes, we have a powerpoint go ahead and cover the zoom screen with that nobody’s gonna miss you not looking at the brady bunch because they don’t know you’re, not looking at the brady bunch. In so doing, you have to think00:22:25

Speakerlook at two things. Only your camera and you notes camera units, then present into the camera and it’ll have the ultimate impact. Even though you never looked at yourself or your audience00:22:38


Speakerthose having someone to help you with with your your your speech earlier presentation come into play, so I liked what you talked about. I each covering up the in covering up the screen with your notes. Are your presentation not necessarily looking at the brady bunch, his ass, you like to say,00:23:00

Speakerwhile you, oh someone, might be they’re like hello, hello, rushed out of the question about his you’re, not seeing them, obviously in a because when you go to the video covered and to the muted, so you don’t see that the democrat hannah. So why are they not around that yeah new zoo meeting by large? You set the rules at it, I’m going to take q and a00:23:20

Speakerafterwards or please put any questions in the chat. Then you could have the chat screen move to the sides. You can keep an eye on it,00:23:29

Speakerbut in a very sophisticated meetings, other people may be watching the chat for you recording those questions so that in the five or ten minutes you have q and a at the end. That person can say art. This question came in from chat earlier. You have someone actually looking through those questions to create m for sort of room of quests.00:23:49

SpeakerShe that they can ask you so set the stages of that zu meeting, so that things aren’t hot things are happening when you mean for them to now. If you do set up an environment where you say anyone who wants to raise their end I’ll call on you, then obviously you need to look at the zoom screen, but people only use chuck00:24:09

Speakernot so strategically. They think of chat is like an open. Mike night was so, I might say something goofy or talk about whatever or they’ll ask an open question. So what you guys, when you think about that? What is twitter swimming gonna say I use chat to teach a group in chat if you liked idea one please type in one. If you liked I00:24:29

Speakerdia to please type in two or ask a very specific question, I want everyone to write. One word: that is your response to the video we just watched or whenever the type into chat. One thing they’re really proud of that they did in the last month or two months during this00:24:49

Speakertime of coding. So I’m asking very specific question some idiot specific answers: new channeling. They use the chat strategically, not just randomly and by the way another quick tip scott and I can’t take credit for this. I pulled it from another conference I went to, but I don’t know who is speaking um seven seconds.00:25:10

SpeakerYou know it seven seconds. It’s seven seconds is the amount of time. You should wait for chat feedback in a zoom meeting at turns. It’s other magical thing. We don’t have statistics minus, but if you stick with me six seconds a you’re cutting off too early and someone was gonna is gonna.00:25:30

SpeakerI asked something or oppose something or contribute something they didn’t get a chance to. So don’t go six seconds but eight seconds, if you’re waiting eight seconds for a response, that’s when it becomes excruciating silence00:25:43

Speakerand some someone suggested and I’ve done is a lotta times enough to believe it. I’m a believer. Ah you can’t seven seconds so. Does anybody else have any questions or did anyone else when I get feedback one two, three, four, five, six seven or eight we’re gonna move on to our next topic matter00:26:04

Speakeras soon as awesome- and I feel you highlight to when say no, it’s basically two problem areas that leaders are pretty weak right now, the one strategic use of a chat. I think this is somewhere where we need to get better leaders need to get better. You see a really good with people in00:26:23

Speakeronline sales. You know these webinar folks, okay, where you called him from iraq, jordan, the throat in the chat and then they’ll start doing shadows and what they’re doing during gauging would write audience. I think sally. I agree with you blah blah blah relic look. Steve said you know, that’s a wonderful technique to call out things that came to the chat, identify00:26:43

Speakerhi the person acknowledge them and to show other people that you wanted to engage in. That engaging will make the zoo meeting even more effective, now and and then the second thing that that seven second rule and shuffling authority on in my back pocket, because I felt out yet though it makes total sense, it’s crazy to think that yeah one second mixed up bigger00:27:03

Speakerdifference, but in this world it definitely does. Ah, so you need to provide a space because know. Sometimes people are fumbling. I yell about ten minutes ago was falling with my might, for some reason wasn’t on duty00:27:17

Speakerand- and you know you might be in a similar situation, so the only give them four seconds or five seconds the design of time for them to fix the problem, but dr seven yeah definitely enough time for curdling ten route is I we’ve all been in meetings where someone says anything else and you get crickets and it starts to get really awkward and by the way00:27:37

Speakershould never never do. One of these two things which is one is beg for questions come on. Does anyone have any questions come out and someone must have a question? We that’s shaming, and you know what a shame are your people and the other is sort of chastising people. I can’t believe they’re, no question, sir00:27:55

Speakerreally I were out. How can it possibly be? You know that’s also shaming, so use the seven second rule ask for it count the seven seconds move on00:28:07

Speakeryeah. No for sure, and actually I, like your last two points, starboard the neon the shaming chastising, because the ultimate yeah it does, how I take those sinners. I’ve explained myself well enough that be all the questions of people may have had were answered in my yeah, my presentation, my briefing my speech00:28:26

Speakereach thread ever some aren’t, let’s move on again, like maybe the cathode, let’s not waste people’s time. Let’s move on00:28:34

Speakerour jaws. Has this been fantastic now, ah, couples I’d like to throw a few different scenarios at you sure yeah and get your advice for the lenders out there, and these are. These are yo scenarios which leaders find themselves in an inconsistent.00:28:52

SpeakerIt’s a constant, been very consistent basis. So the first one is, you know you gotta break the bad news. Maybe is you gonna fire somebody? Maybe profits are down, maybe there’s gonna lay offs who knows, but that bad news. So what’s your advice to readers out there implying that bad news to their tutor people right what it’s true, often you’re gonna00:29:12

Speakerneed to say. I share some bad news and the first thing you wanna do is find a way to insert hope,00:29:22

Speakerbecause imagine that you are captain on a ship and it’s taking on water. Do the people really want to hear more about how high the water is rising or how low this ship is sinking or what our chances of drowning are? No, they don’t wanna hear more of that, but they want to hear how we’re going to get out of there00:29:42

Speakersort of lease what we’re going to do next.00:29:46

SpeakerSo I always answered hoping one of the tricks where tactics they recommend with that is to use hope as a noun and not a verb, because hope is a verb says I hope will get through this or I hope this will be alright. I hope it’s not gonna rain tomorrow.00:30:03

SpeakerI hope the red sox win. You know whatever, if you just you’re you’re, just throwing it out for chance right it’s out of my control. I hope it’ll happen. Who knows, but if you’d hope is a now venue saying this gives me hope00:30:17

Speakerthat we will weather this and have a better fourth quarter or even I have hope, based on the data that we will find a way around once every getting bad news. Obviously this is where you wanna be authentic. You wanna be truthful. You want to be clear, a here’s mistake. Some leaders make the sugar00:30:38

Speakerbut psychological, even not sugar coating it because you’re afraid of their audience receiving it. Their sugar coating it because it’s easier for them to say something. That’s a little sugary percent, the hard truth, but listen you’re, a leader with great responsibility with great power00:30:57

Speakercomes great responsibility is not the spiderman friends, so your responsibility is to be truthful, to be clear, not to over explain, which is something a lot of leaders. Do maybe the more I talk. Oh, oh, you I’ll get people so tired of me that they won’t even be bothered anymore,00:31:17

Speakerso be clear, be short, be truthful and try to inject hope as much as you can that’s your job as a leader and what that means is that’s your job to communicate all those things.00:31:30

SpeakerIt goes back to your base to beginning and we talked wrote being inspirational author right. This is where, at a time where you build that know authentic currency in in people and leaving you and you come across new. I got hope that we we’ll get through this. That inelegant spite of like yacht the bosses and loggers down00:31:50

Speakerand if he’s got, hope we can do this in the inspiration starts coming out and it is great. You talk for a story earlier and I got one myself where I was talking to a former, a business owner, ceo of a of a business of printing press in two thousand and eight. He was telling me about how you all orders dried up instead00:32:11

Speakerlike like almost overnight, and he said no, we will weather this and we will. We will not lose one person in this process and that’s what he told his teammates said. There’s lots of days we showed up. We did absolutely nothing, but we are know clean up around the building and we make sure things were nice and we got to know each other and in the end, once sad review started coming back,00:32:31

Speakercan he didn’t lose a single one of his employees through the fake thing? Another tip is something I talk about in the book is ivers, as we were for the most part when a leader says I hear saying something personal.00:32:46

SpeakerI want us to get through this. I need us to meet our goals. This is important to me and when a leader says that using ai they may think they’re being transparent, but what they’re actually doing is putting themselves above their team instead of among their team a what put you among your team that something00:33:05

Speakeryou want to communicate is we we will get through this. Oh, we’ve never had a challenge like this before, but we will get through this because your employees, your staff, your team, they want to know that the leadership is with them suffering with them facing challenges with them and working together00:33:25

Speakerare with you00:33:27

Speakerto overcome the problem.00:33:31

SpeakerNever about you, it’s about the team. I’ll always say I did us, as leaders were two reasons for our team’s failures with the team to risen, far successes so gonna go that we wrote for sure right00:33:45

Speakerart. So, let’s, let’s talk about your a word- must just keep going on the screen own crisis crisis line here in how and what tips do you have for leaders out fair in how they should communicate during you know, during a crisis, I I think we kind of touched on it, but a I wanna young stewardship, even worn that dress,00:34:05

Speakereven though no water, your vice their fur, for leaders in those crisis, crisis situations such as the o two thousand and eight economic downturn,00:34:15

Speakerand how did you communicate with their team’s short know? One of things you mentioned earlier was rest short of those words of magical power is talk about some more tactics once more mistakes, sometimes a leader will say well. This has been so hard for me and your executive leadership team. We talk for weeks about00:34:35

Speakerthis. We didn’t get any sleep.00:34:37

SpeakerOh, we were communicating late at night about this and they think that it demonstrates a leader’s, a commitment to solving the problem, but all it really says is: ah I had a tough time with this. This is a difficult process for me, but they’re not talking about00:34:57

Speakerwell. You know what you and I were talking about scott, which is what are we going through a? What are we going through together? The team is not going to care how much this troubles you as the leader. They want to know what we are going to do to get out of it.00:35:14

SpeakerSo don’t focus on yourself a don’t try to focus on things that you fear. You don’t know where that you don’t understand. Have you don’t know something you should say I don’t know we will get back to you, but speculation and wondering aloud just creates a very00:35:34

Speakershaky ground. You know what does anyone want to know during the crisis? The ground is firm under their feet if only their personal feet or lisa that’s getting firmer when a leader, hedges or speculates or wonders were say, maybe this or maybe that it’s making the ground softer. You want to00:35:55

Speakerfirm up things, so the things you can say clearly and here’s another phrase that helps here’s what I can say a very, very useful phrase. Here’s what I can say I know we’re facing a tremendous challenge, but here’s what I can say. I know that if we work together because I’ve seen it before remember the x y z00:36:15

Speakerproject, we can do that again and add success or here’s what I know or here’s what I’ve seen are. Those are great phrases to say. I have faith in you and I’m going to tell you this. Do you know, apart from what the challenges are, what I know personally in my heart? This is what I’ve seen and00:36:35

SpeakerI’m going to trust this, and you should too, especially if you’re saying what I’ve seen is something you seen from the team00:36:44

Speakerthis where humility comes into play, ripe, yet priority humble as a leader in these situations, especially the times when you get asked questions. Were you know the answer?00:36:54

SpeakerI don’t know right now, but I’ll find out for you and I’ll get back to. You is quick as possible.00:37:00

SpeakerA number one is be truthful,00:37:03

Speakerdon’t say: half truths, don’t try to sugarcoat it. The number one thing that your team expects from you in a crisis is truth, a hard truth, honest truth00:37:16

Speakerin short, concise truth. They want to be able to process, it gives them time to process it and and then then give them reason to hope.00:37:26

SpeakerWhy would think if you’re consistently use dragging things out stumbling as you talk that is actually gonna, give the inverse effect of people thinking while he doesn’t know what he’s taught my skills like he’s, making copies yoga, bringing it right now he actually doesn’t know what the heck he’s talking about that got. The boot we got a pulp00:37:46

Speakerzynga the ship before it sinks right exactly exactly using that metaphor awesome. So, let’s flip the coin ives other side there we talked about you’re, going through tough times, are soccer the the good times in the only route made in plum made a big win. We win bail, the bigger cowed, big contract. Maybe we had some kind of milestone. Who knows00:38:06

Speakerso? How can we go about making sure that people feel that their part of that a watertight iowa tactic, stare for leaders at third or right? Let’s take a very specific scenario here I mean I we could talk about, we should celebrate, we should bring the team in. These are obvious things, but here’s mistake. I see leaders do often, which is very,00:38:26

Speakervery shallow thanks.00:38:29

SpeakerSometimes they think that the mere words thank you or thanks is like checking a box called appreciation, but it you know reno from having heard thanks in our lives. It has not a very lasting value or impact. We forget about it an hour later, because there was nothing there. Not only was there not substance, but00:38:49

Speakera lot of people get thinks. Why was the things that I got unique sword? I encourage leadership to do whether we’re celebrating a big win or whether you’re thanking an employee or a team, is to always include the why I want to celebrate this win, but I also wanna acknowledge the hard work00:39:09

Speakerof the eckstein. The x team in the x t y no put in extra hours to make sure all of our numbers were correct,00:39:18

Speakeror I want to thank our pr t for making sure that, as the media newspapers covered this, they always covered us positively. She always ask yourself: why are you thanking them and were one to? How is what they did?00:39:38

SpeakerDid this success? How does it impact the overall goal of the organization? So thank you for doing this. It’s really making a difference in how we are perceived, and I believe that it is also moving us further toward our goal of, and you should always know what00:39:59

Speakerthis ends with, if you’re, a leader, saving more lives,00:40:02

Speakerpreserving the earth selling more coca cola,00:40:07

Speakerselling more product x, improving public health, whatever your big bottom line is a bring it out as an impact of whatever that success is exalted. Some ex got to see a lot of presentations, whether their leaders are not the end with. If we do this right, we’re gonna get more traffic to our website.00:40:27

SpeakerI have we do this right, we’re gonna build more facilities. If we do this right, oh we’ll get more money through fundraising and those are never the ultimate goals. If we do this right and get more traffic to our website, what is the? So? What is my wife,00:40:47

Speakerall teacher? Where is the so? What there so more traffic comes to our website, so more people buy our product. So more people are aware of this issue and take action to solve. It always know what I call your highest value outcome and specifically articulate that not just the medium goal,00:41:08

Speakeroh for love that now do it, because we’re saving lives. What is right, what is our saving measure when saving lives, but I wanna as a saving lives. You need to know yours is an absolutely00:41:22

Speakeryeah wow. That’s awesome,00:41:25

Speakerdraw up your home know how we can actually wrap up the show, even better than that. I think I’m just gonna give you up in the air. Will save lives yeah seriously? Why you you torrent you’re, talking to you, don’t talk to a guy who buy days, senior kane army officer. So that’s that’s where that’s where I live. That’s that’s. Where I live thread, your hadn’t hit me start to harden00:41:45

Speakeryeah. Actually, apes yeah, I was a briefing is presenting to eat a brand new group of officer candidates for my trip. Pass them was at what do we do in in military and what’s our purpose and all kinds of all kinds of answers, and I bolted out in like an hour here to save lives. Folks, bracelet were here for me00:42:05

Speakerin a day, so not to earn medals but to say blossoming. That’s right, you gotta, ah joe discipline, fantastic, truly appreciate you and your time before we wrap up, though, got a couple of questions for you00:42:19

Speakerfurther being a as all the guests here at the peak performance, leadership, podcast crew new. What makes a great leader00:42:28

Speakera great leader, is someone who engages and inspires their team, the scott I said this at the beginning. We said it through, but I wanna make a point here. If you have a big point to make, do not be afraid to say it over and over again, because that’s the one thing you want your audience to take away. So what I want audiences to00:42:47

Speakertake away. I don’t have break something new out here. I want to reinforce my big takeaway, which is rude their voice, whether it’s on video or zoo, or a podcast post through their voice leaders, have the ability to engage and inspire their teams. If they choose the right one00:43:07

Speakerwords, mindsets and tactics,00:43:11

Speakerlove, it love it and fall. Question of the show is ah compute will find you. How can the value be part of your journey is also your gonna00:43:19

Speakersure. My love him. The follow me on twitter and my twitter is the jewel truth.00:43:26

SpeakerSometimes the people in I t enjoy. When I say I consider my work open code. It is I like to share everything I know so I share it there. But if you wanna go to my platform, you want to learn about both books. Get to the point. The language of leadership go to w w w dot, joel schwartzberg dot net. That’s j, o e l00:43:46

Speakers c, h, w a r, p c b e r g dot net, though schwartzberg forgotten man. You could find my podcast. I write articles for fast company in harvard business review. You could see them they’re. My joy is in sharing these ideas, so everybody can be. We don’t compete with each other in leadership all the time.00:44:06

SpeakerSo I want everybody all leaders in all emerging leaders to be in the best position to champion their most important points.00:44:15

SpeakerAbsolutely new lot for you the listener. It’s easy. As always, go to moving for lucia dot com forward, slash one nine two one, nine two and the lengths from the show notes to my friend thank you again for taking time in your busy schedule, truly appreciate you and everything you have to do.00:44:32

SpeakerThank you, scott. It’s my pleasure and I appreciate you as well.